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Can art be random? Thoughts about procedural generation.

Thoughts that I say will seem banal, it is. But if the great, rich companies make bets on pre -failed ideas, then these thoughts should be repeated until all the game designers and consumers will hear them.

Can art be random? (MASS Effect: Andromeda Project Play.)

To convincingly say, you need to answer the pretentious question “What is art?”For me, art is a meaning, not even so – it is a transmission of meaning by creative. Impossible create a random meaning or to create a meaning in an inconsistent, but you can endow the randomness with meaning, and this is not a single one and the same. But is it possible to place a “meaning” in the “accident”?
This is what Bioware Montreal tried to do in Mass Effect: Andromeda, about this and generally about the problems of creating the game, writes Jason Schreier – news editor for Kotaku.

The director Gerard Lehiani tried, who previously directed Spider-Man games in the BENOX studio belonging to the Activision.

There should be hundreds of the studied planets. BioWare will use algorithms for the procedural generation of each world in the game, allowing almost endless opportunities, the style of no man’s Sky. (No Man’s Sky has not yet been announced – Bioware has developed this concept separately).
Procedural generation – automatic creation of game content using algorithms, and does not require that each element of the game be processed manually. Throughout 2013 and 2014, Andromeda developers played with all the ideas that are clearly sounding in No Man’s Sky today. They built prototypes in which you will pilot a spaceship around the galaxy, and then use it to land on planets. From there you can jump into your space nomad and explore every new world, hunting in a inhabited area. Then you could return to space and fly a little more. “It was a very ambitious project,” said one of the sources. “We wanted to give a sensation of a truly studying space”.
However, there were problems. One of the protracted issues for the Andromeda team was how they could realize the history of BioWare Caliber in the game with planets generated procedural.

I emphasize: company 2 years tried to realize the “meaning” in procedural generation. Question: It does not seem to you this in advance? The scene affects the atmosphere and details of the plot. For example, heroes pursue an antagonist on a procedurally generated planet. According to the plot, the main characters should not catch him. How to determine where on an entire planet they will catch up with it? What if the path that they run is at a standstill? We come to the conclusion – the action in the plots takes place in obviously known places.
Someone will say that trying to make the impossible-noble. Then I will ask: they had a chance for success? With modern technologies and implementation methods? No! It seems completely banal and understandable things, and hundreds of people have not accepted them for two years. How? Why?

Is the creation of algorithms and the laws of the universe of these worlds by creativity or is it just mathematical formulas?

(On the example of no man’s Sky.)

You need to understand how the game works. I will speak in a simple way. It’s hard here). Steam has a Steam Guard mobile application, it increases the protection of the hacking account, namely generates, personally for each user the key code. It consists of 5 characters – numbers (0.1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9) and English. letters. For example, “F6R2R”. We know all the letters and numbers that the algorithm can use – it cannot create anything new. However, like us – people. We can create something only from collective images of a familiar. The fact is that not all our collective images are combined with each other, and some are combined only because of the meaning with which we unite them. And if you ask a question: who will create a planet better – a computer or a person? The answer will not depend on the number of variables (options). Very rarely on the slot machine, one row of pears or watermelons, or a meaningful row-arbuene, knife, plate falls on a slot machine. Planet 1/10 cases will be better for a person created by a person through this reason. And when it will be better 1/10 times, it will be much worse 5/10 times.

Когда создают или просчитывуют возможные варианты или возможное значение переменной в алгоритмах, люди оперируют только знанием вещей, или формул – не важно, факт в том, что они не создают, а вспоминают возможные варианты. Therefore, the answer –No!
Is it possible to achieve the magic of a research spirit in the procedural-refined worlds?
I will quote one of the authors Blog Stopgame. Sanvis:

The ship’s skin is still smoke,
The terrain has not yet been scanned,
My leg steps into the unknown,
Which they have not seen before me.

Around the plants of unprecedented beauty
Creating an unknown breed
It is a pity that all this is only a particle of code,
What will pass me just for the clock.

This verse perfectly characterizes expectations from procedural generation of both players and gamed designers. But all of the above is suitable here and here. Or you need to run the generation again and again, until all the stars become in a row and fall out 1/10, or it is necessary to carry out post -cutting these worlds. If you create very, very many variables, you will receive unimaginable and illogical combinations from which you will have an overdose of endorphins.

But if you create a lot of laws, for example, on cold planets in fauna and flora, only appropriate variables are included. Only as I have already said the planet created by hand will always be better and it proves our world, none of us wanted to wander around the moon or Mars for a long time, there is nothing but hills and hills, and the majority of such planets in our world. Our planet is like a needle in a hay – a very, very rare case. What idiot will make people explore 9 empty, uninteresting planets to find the tenth exciting and this is lucky.

Infinite X-Com 2

X-Com2 is the best example of applying procedural generation in games. The creators of the game manually create a setting of location and, by complexity of the assignment, determine the number and type of enemies (some random, like there is, but this is not exactly), and all shelters (decorations) are placed by procedural generation. Details how the system works in the video Gamespot (original, translation)
This is an ideal example of manual programming symbiosis with autonomous. Earlier, I mainly talked about the minuses of generation, now let’s about the pluses:
1.In the X-Com: Enemy Unknown there were 70 locations, in the new part, each card is tactically new, which makes each reproduction of the game unique. I myself have not yet played the second part, so the question for you is where the cards are better? Failers of generation occur? For example, SID Meier’s Civilization V is randomly created by unique resources and it happens very often that one very rare mineral is focused on one point on the map.
2. The speed of creating a new object, it is literally created when loading the level or when starting the game.

Generation problems in Middle-Earth: Shadow of War

The game is the best example of how important it is to have many options and variables. After all, the magic of unique passage is completely dependent on this. In the game there are orcs in the same types of armor (one type of armor I met on more than 4 leaders), the same appearance. And God forbid you to pay attention to what they say, because single -thoughts who say the same thing, in the game, found only one such case (such twins were in different locations), but maybe I did not notice some. There are chances to go through the game and not see such jambs, but I was not lucky.

The game has many changes, but few options for them. That is, the chance that you will see an orc that says, dressed, looks and endowed with the same characteristics -a little small (0.05% chance). But separately x (clothing), y (dialogue) is not enough variable. I want to say that these dialogs do not add charisma orcs and if the dialogs are difficult to make diverse, then there is no need to dream about the randomization of the character traits in the near future.

Result. Procedure generation is the future, it allows you to create an infinite number of content, which is why companies so extol this technology. But the content created by hand is much better. And until she learned to generate “meaning”, we can classify games for art.

P.WITH.
I’m just a hand -generation heit and my opinion costs nothing, but I think you will agree with me in many ways.

No Man’s Sky

Xcom 2

Mass Effect: Andromeda

Middle-Earth: Shadow of War

The best comments

People are my first blog In life, If my thoughts are interested in raisins, answer my philosophical questions and of course indicate the jambs. And maybe inspire one more thought.I already have ideas about what.

I think that the most important jamb is that you yourself did not read what you wrote. Thinking is clear, but the method of expression, to put it mildly, is lame.

For himself, after the seminar of one fairly smart uncle, the concept of “art” into a fairly simple formulation brought out the concept of “art. More precisely, the test of art goes precisely under compliance with the concept of “Gestalt”, dismantled in this seminar. “The whole is always more than the sum of parts”. This, in fact, is determined by art, as for me. When you look, for example, at the picture, and perceive not only what is depicted on it, but also something more that is laid down by the author (it doesn’t matter if it is a thoughtful double bottom or a simple metaphor).
According to such a concept, any content itself is not necessarily an art. Two months ago, an artbook with the concept-arts of the Plarium studio was adjusted to me-beautiful, juicy pictures, but without a gram of meaning or even imagery. And this is not close to art, although artists painted by hand. Not every book can also be classified as films, like games, like games (while IMHO, the genre of the work generally does not determine belonging to art – you can make a documentary that, in its execution, will eclipse many artistic ones, etc.D.).
In the same way, in fact, “dual” – procedural generation is only a tool, and it all depends on the hands of which, and the goals for which it is used. But not in itself.

In the X-Com: Enemy Unknown there were 70 locations, in the new part, each card is tactically new, which makes each reproduction of the game unique. I myself have not yet played the second part, so the question for you is where the cards are better? Failers of generation occur? In the X-Com: Enemy Unknown there were 70 locations, in the new part, each card is tactically new, which makes each reproduction of the game unique. I myself have not yet played the second part, so the question for you is where the cards are better? Failers of generation occur?

The generation is definitely better. The prepared cards in the first XCOM are enough from the strength for two passages, then there will only be repetitions (and when playing with the Long War mod and there will not be enough cards for one passage). There are no such problems with the generation. Yes, over time, you will remember what the objects of the locations from which are built cards look, but there are mods that add new objects. Therefore, there are no problems with a variety.
The strangeness in generation arose only once (the couple of mods were slightly conflict): on one of the cards, the XCOM detachment sprinkled into a truck and had to get them from there a grenade. And on the same map, one of the cars was parked in the pool (although it may be a feature and not a bug).

There is no more question for that What written (although there are questions here), but to that How. I am far from a great connoisseur of the Russian language, therefore, when I see many mistakes on such a small text, this is a complete arctic fox. Some pieces are generally similar to the work of an electronic translator.

There is such a phenomenon – “contemporary art”. Here it can be absolutely ruthless and random. AND Lovers of searching for hidden meaning connoisseurs see this very art in many moments.

A slightly detached thought on which the title prompted.

How to determine where on an entire planet they will catch up with it? What if the path that they run is at a standstill?

Well, this type is quite easily by introducing small amendments to the generator code (or a slightly more difficult way – the system for plot actions will look for suitable generated locations).

Another thing is that, for example, in the case of a pursuit, it will be very difficult to take into account the global features of the planet/biom. T.e. The pursuit of a snow -covered desert, in the real desert, along the sea, through the forest and in swampy areas – these are different chases: at a different pace, different potential “tricks” from the runaway and so on.

In general, some very strange jump on the topic. Procedure-granular orcs (as well as tactical cards) what is generally related to the topic given by the heading? Why carefully ignored the positive experience of procedural generation? One of the main pillars of which is (unexpectedly) minecraft. You can relate to hype around the game, to its community, but it is extremely difficult to deny that in the game about freedom of expression of expression, it is even more difficult to do without procedural generation. And Minecraft is excellently copes with this-the local procedural-executed environment is slightly less global-procedural, when compared with O Man’s Sky, but it is interesting, diverse and perfectly performs all the tasks assigned to it. However, from the traditional point of view, Minecraft may not be “art”, because there are no clear messages and “author’s position” here, the sandbox of pure water.

Naturally. The man Bljad from improvised parts collected devices that count him time and help to overcome huge distances. It’s to cool! Of course this is art, what else? Man himself is essentially art, if you see this.
Although here you can highlight a reservation about converse production. But if handmade is definitely art.

I apologize, when re -reading I noticed a lot of mistakes. Corrected. If you have questions, please ask.

Hi, I liked the record.

You need to re-read the text and search it in https://instaspincasino.uk/ some places yet:

Thoughts, which I will say will seem banal, it is. But if the great, rich companies make bets on pre -failed ideas, then these thoughts should repeatbXia, until all the game designers and consumers will not hear them.

You need a comma after the word “thought” and a soft sign in the word “repeat”

“To” need to write together

It is impossible to create a random meaning or Injected create meaning, but you can endow the accident with a meaning, and this is not one and Same.

“Information” must be written together, and “the same” is separate

I need a colon after “emphasize”, “s” in the word “tried”

You need a colon after the “question”, a comma after “you” does not need

You need a comma after “determine”

I need a comma after the “path”

Someone will say that trying to make the impossible-noble._Then I will ask: they had a chance for success?

Need a gap in front of “then”

We need “C” instead of “s”

Is whether the creation of algorithms and the laws of the universe of these worlds by creativity or is it just mathematical formulas?

It is necessary to “be” instead of “they”, it is one creation, although it also creates algorithms and laws

Steam has a Steam Guard mobile application, it increases the protection of the hacking account, namely generates, personally for every user, Key code.

“Personally for each user” can be framed by commas, but you can not frame

“Substitat from something” (from components)

We know all the letters and numbers, which can use the algorithm – it cannot create anything new.

You need a comma after the “digit”

Commas before and after “something” are not needed

The fact is that not all of ours are collectivee images are combined with each other, and some are combined only because of the meaning, which we unite them.

We need “e” at the end “collective”, a comma after the “meaning”

When creating or Calculate possible options or possible valueNNoh in algorithms, people operate only with knowledge of things or formulas – Not It is important, the fact is, that they do not create, but remember possible options. Therefore, the answer – No!

It is necessary to “calculate” instead of “forth”, double “n” in “variable”, “not” instead of “nor”, ​​a comma after “volume”, dash after “answer”

Achieve something, the case is genitive, therefore it is necessary “magic” instead of “magic”, a hyphen in the “procedural-reflective”, a gap after the “worlds” is not needed

After Sanvis you need a colon

This verse ideally characterizes expectations from procedural generation_Both players and gamemeracies.

After “generation” a comma is not needed

But all of the above_Suitable here._Or you need to run the generation again and again, until all the stars become in a row and falls 1/10, or you need to carry out Post -cutting These worlds.

Do not need a comma after the “said”, you need a gap in front of “or”, the word “post -cutting” is together

If you create very, very many variables, you will receive unimaginable and illogical combinations, from which you will have an overdose of endorphins.

You need a comma after a “combination”

It is necessary to add a comma after “I recognize”, and in the word “endorphins” at the beginning, put “e” instead of “e”

But if you create a lot of laws, for example, on cold planets At animals and fauna only appropriate variables are included.

Here is a semantic mistake: the animals are already a fauna, you can only leave “at the animals”, or only “at the fauna”, or write “in fauna and flora”, that is, at animals and vegetation

Only as I have already said the planet created by hand will always be better and this proves our world, none of us wanted to wander around the moon for a long time or Mars, There is nothing but mountains_and hills, and such planets in our world are the majority._Our planet is like a needle in a hay – a very, very rare case.

It is necessary to “Mars” instead of “Mars”, male Mars, we wander along it, do not need a comma after the “mountains”, we need a gap in front of “ours”

You need a dash after “X-Com2”

The creators of the game manually create a setting of location and, by complexity of the assignment, determine the number and type of enemies_(ToAkoy–then it seems to be a random in this, but this is not exactly), but all shelters (scenery) are placed in procedural generation._Details, How the system works, Watch the Gamespot video_(original, translation)

We need a gap after the “enemies”, the letter “A” instead of “O” and the hyphen in the word “some”, you need a gap in front of “details” and a comma after a “system”, you need a gap after “Gamespot”

Need “C” instead of “s”

For example, SID Meier’s Civilization V is randomly created by unique resources and it happens very often, that one very rare mineral is concentrated at one point on the map.

Commas after “often”

2. The speed of creating a new object, it is literally created when loadinge level or when starting the game.

We need “e” at the end of the word “loading”, instead of “and”

You need a dash after the word “game”, you need a comma after “that”, and after “important” a comma is not needed

In the game there are orcs in the same types of armor (ODean View of the armor I met on more than 4 leaders), the same appearance.

Do not need a gap in front of the word “one”, you need to add the word “the same” before the word “appearance”

And God forbid you to pay attention to, What they say, For one -thoughts, who say the same thing, There are many in the game, I myself found only one such case (such twins were in different locations), but maybe I did not notice a few.

A comma is needed after “that”, a comma after “they say”, a comma after “single -thoughts”, a comma after “too”

That is chance, What will you see orc, who says, dressed, looks and endowed with the same characteristics – negligible (0.05% chance).

“That is” must be written separately, a comma is needed after the word “chance”, a comma after “orc”

I want to say that these dialogs do not add charisma orcs and if the dialogs are difficult to make diverse, then About randomization Damn the characters to dream In the near future Do not have to.

“Dream of something”, about what will happen (when?) – “In the near future”

Result. Procedure generation – This is the future, it allows you to create an infinite number of content, because of what companies are so extolled by this technoYu. But content, Created by hand, Significantly better. And for now she I have not learned to generate “meaning”, we can consider games for art.

After the word “generation”, a comma after the “content” is necessary, correct the letter “I” on the letter “Yu” at the end of the word “technology”, put the commas in front and after the turn “created by hand”, and correct “it” on “it” because “generation”

I won’t say much about the generation, in few games I played a similar sense, where the generation solved more tasks than the contents of the chest at the end of the dungeon. I do not think that it can generate meaning, it is in itself a means to complete the task. Like a shovel does not create a meaning until a person takes it and digs the pit for the foundation for a new building in which people will live or work, then the meaning appears.

Well, in any case, you have a very strange sample in order to reflect on procedural generation, again. However, the position

In fact, a very interesting topic, and is cool to watch how “cars” create art. Given the large share of PHP developers, I can advise this article on generative art.

The article provides 2 real examples and describes an algorithm for immersion in creative programming. In short, it should be interesting!

The main idea of ​​procedural generation kills art in games. Or harms this status for the gaming industry. I reveal this topic with questions to which the answer is obvious. For example, “Can the art be accidental?”But I answer this question:” Art is the transmission of meaning by creative.»What all other arguments depart from.And yes, I read what I wrote, I recognize only it was written uneasy, but how much more interesting on me. Thanks for the comment.

Damn, and I bought the second on a curling iron, I decided to try it in a strategy of this type played on the couch. You have to be without mods.

but something more that is laid down by the author (it doesn’t matter if it is a thoughtful double bottom or a simple metaphor).